December 9, 2009 / 18:20
Freddie, one part of the story you didn't read because apparently the Star (aka Pravda) conveniently left it out, was that the report recently reviewed by Natynczyk also stated that the Canadian soldiers took back the prisoner immediately upon realizing the prisoner was being tortured.
I guess that part of the story didn't jive with the whole slam our military and government goal.
To everyone that is going to jump all over this story. The Liberals got us into this mess, and although before we set one boot in Afghanistan I was against it, once Jean Chretien sent us in there, I was in support of this submission because we as a country committed to it. I detest the news of every soldier that comes back in a body bag, but to make those sacrifices worth anything we have to, at the very least, leave the place better than when we got there. Just because we have a different government, doesn't justify changing our commitments.
If you Liberal supporters don't like the situation, take it up with Jean, Paul, Stephane and Mike, and the innability of the Liberal Party to get their head out of their collective a$$, elect a decent leader, and win an election. I'm sure if the Liberal reign was still in place, we'd all be on the same page with the Afghan mission.
December 9, 2009 / 19:22
Politics. Whomever is on the other side of the House of Commons will say whatever gets them one vote. No particular skill in being a critic. They are all very good at it. They are all very good at defending themselves.
Managing the country is another story. One at which they are mediocre at best.
December 9, 2009 / 19:34
"Ignatieff and Layton and the Toronto Star and everybody else who wants to turn this into something it isn't should be ashamed of themselves."
I agree 100% Fred - could you please add Harper's name to that list, as he has tried to turn this into a political campaign ad.
December 9, 2009 / 21:17
In Trenton, where I take my Dad shopping every few weeks when I can go see him, they say "If you don't stand behind our troops, feel free to stand in front of Them"..enough said..Support Our Troops..
December 9, 2009 / 21:47
Don't like to see the Canadian Forces being used as political fodder in Ottawa.
Who ever is in opposition side of the house uses the same dirty tricks no matter what their stripes.
December 9, 2009 / 22:05
It makes me sick to think that we should question the actions of those protecting our freedom. I was never in the military and I regret not taking that challenge on. I can't begin to describe the pride I have for those who have served our country. Those who choose to report shit about them should be left in enemy hands for 1 day and then decide whether bashing our military is justified.. They should all just shut the fuck up...
December 9, 2009 / 23:11
I think both Harper supporters and haters can agree Afghanistan is a huge mess.
Two years ago, Iraq looked like a situation that no one could fix. The surge fixed that but I must admit I doubt another surge could fix this Afghanie-hellhole. They are living in the stone age. Any attempts to civilize these people is a waste of time, of our soldiers life and of course, money.
Christopher Hitchens once said, the Russians bombed Afghanistan INTO the stone age, not back to it.
December 10, 2009 / 01:06
"Criticism of our side on any level is nothing short of slimy."
Spoken like a true supporter of a totalitarian state.
People who don't understand what the problem is and who wish everyone would just shut up are more like the people we're fighting than they'd like to think. We're accountable for our actions, we hold ourselves to a higher standard.
"Support Our Troops" is a great philosophy and a lovely saying, but most of you are using it will extreme ignorance and stupidity.
Pauly - if it was up to Harper we'd have gone into Iraq as well, and still be there. Get off your high horse.
December 10, 2009 / 10:00
The Star and the Liberals seem to think Natynczyk story change is an indictment on MacKay.
I think the opposite, MacKay is only as good as the information he's given from the field. This change only helps to absolve MacKay.
December 10, 2009 / 10:14
The very fact that no one gives a damn about this non-story is reason enough to end this hopeless waste of Canadian lives and money. Any effort on the government's part to justify this wheel-spinning falls on deaf ears. Yes, we all support and care for the safety of our troops, but how many really support the mission? I suspect the numbers reported are far lower in reality.
December 10, 2009 / 10:44
Mikey, What high horse is that. Pointing out that you and the rest of the Liberals are all hypocrits? Unlike you turncoats, I'm backing the decision and commitment Chretien made on this country's behalf.
Yes Harper wanted to go to Iraq, and I never supported that. I commend Chretien for not kissing Bush's a$$. Afghanistan is marginally better, but as I said wouldn't have gone there either, but we're their now.
Chretien took us to Afghanistan, but now it's somehow Harper's fault? Our military is in a backward country where respect for people is nonexistent and it is Harper's fault that people are getting tortured by their own people?
What never ceases to amaze me is how logic always takes a back seat in the bullsh!t you spew.
December 10, 2009 / 11:29
Chretien took us there as peace keepers we evolved into a combat role wtih Harper.
December 10, 2009 / 11:38
Frank, invading a country and toppling a ruling government is not peace keeping. Sorry, you have it backwards. We invaded, we installed a new government and now we're battling insurgents and trying to keep the peace (if we can say there is any peace to keep).
December 10, 2009 / 11:41
Unfortunately the Liberal Media "conveniently" forget that 3000 people were tortured on 9/11.I agree the Liberals, NDP, and everyone else that slams our commitment in Afghanistan should shut up and go away.
December 10, 2009 / 12:08
Well said Phil. Afghanistan may be a difficult war to win, but it is needed to be faught. Completely different than the Iraq war.
Our men need to trust that when we hand over prisoners that they will no be tortured. The issue should be with the Afghan Authorities.
December 10, 2009 / 12:50
Frank tank, what liberal kool-aid did you drink?
There is no such thing as a peace keeper in that shit hole of a country, not now, not ever.
There are only soldiers who these inhuman animals want to kill.
Defend or die, what peace were you dreaming of? You're a tank, why don't you get over there?
December 10, 2009 / 13:26
Yeah Freddie I guess the comment about nobody caring about this issue isn't as true as you think it is. Once again living in your small world and some of the people who post here you think your ideas are the only ones all Canadians share. Guess not by this poll.
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/blogs/bureau-blog/stephen-harpers-salad-days-are-done/article1395696/
Murph get over it. How is Afghanistan a concern and not Iraq???????
Chipper... no such thing as a peace keeper ok.... so it was a combat role from the beginning?? Is that what you are telling me?
December 10, 2009 / 14:55
Frank,
I live in Angus and I don't know if you ever heard of this town but you can't walk 2 metres without bumping into a soldier.
In spite of what you may have heard it was combat in Afghanistan right from the beginning.
Unless you want to stand around and peacekeep, I mean die.
December 10, 2009 / 16:07
It must have irked the Star, to have to print the text to Obama's speech to the Nobel committee today.
"A non-violent movement could not have halted Hitler's armies. Negotiations cannot convince al Qaeda's leaders to lay down their arms.
To say that force may sometimes be necessary is not a call to cynicism -- it is a recognition of history; the imperfections of man and the limits of reason"
Brave words from a man destined for greatness. The entire speech is here:
http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/remarks-president-acceptance-nobel-peace-prize
December 10, 2009 / 16:43
Shorter Freddie P:
I don't care about scandals if they hurt my team.
There. I saved everyone having to read more than 10 paragraphs of Fred treading water.
December 10, 2009 / 17:05
...if we can't win over there, what makes you think we can win here...fact is, we can't...
December 10, 2009 / 21:08
Frank, just who the hell do you imagine we were "keeping the peace" between? The Taliban and the rest of the NATO forces? Let me try and help you: Peacekeepers are put in place to keep two hostile sides from fighting. From day one, our forces, along with the rest of the NATO troops went to Afghanistan to engage and kill Taliban. Comprende?
December 10, 2009 / 21:23
Pauly,
You know I love ya and agree with you on most things but it seems that invading Iraq was a better horse to bet on than jumping into the mess that is Afghanistan.
Aside form the monthly suicide bombings (which is par for the course in any muslim country), Iraq is a country club compared to Afgh'n.
In hindsight, Canada should have followed Bush into Iraq and let the French & Brits deal with the other crap-hole country.
And Pam, please take it easy on sucking up to Obie. I agree with the extra troops but him winning the Nobel Peace Prize makes as much sense as Tiger winning 'Husband of the year' for 2009.
December 11, 2009 / 05:01
Fred...I cannot believe that you think this is a non-story. If this were a Liberal government, would you say the same thing??
December 11, 2009 / 12:17
From today's National Post...
"The fact is that the opposition has no interest in either this mission, or in the safety of Afghans, suspected Taliban or otherwise. If they did they would have supported this mission from the beginning, and would continue to support it. They have no interest in morality, for if they did they could not stomach the idea of leaving the country to a barbaric tribe with laws rooted in the 7th Century A.D. Let’s not pretend this detainee affair is anything but deflection and distraction from the core issue, defeating the enemy, and identify it for what it truly represents: rank political opportunism intended to gain a few votes in the next election in Canada".
And here's the link for the entire article:'
http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fullcomment/archive/2009/12/11/adrian-macnair-for-friday.aspx
December 13, 2009 / 21:35
Argie, buddy I have to disagree with you on this one. In my view, they're both bad ideas. Iraq was and still is about nothing but oil. The fact that the US was buddy buddy with Saddam and got him into power, makes it only fitting that he turned on them. Don't meddle is the simple message.
As for Afghanistan, the Russians had their own Vietnam there. The only thing that gives me a sliver of hope for our Canadian troops is that they're trying to build infrastructure not trying to level everything. Its up to the locals to embrace it or not.
December 14, 2009 / 23:27
Pauly,
Unfortunately, they''re not embracing it. In fact they've voted with their roadside bombs....
The idea of a girl being able to attend school or allowing a woman to go out in public without her husband are not things they're ready for. After all, they're still living in the 50s - that would be 750 a.d.
December 15, 2009 / 12:23
Merry Christmas everybody.
I am a retired Canadian-ex RCAF,and I create slide shows as a hobby.This show is a Christmas Greeting to the Canadian Armed Forces.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3h8hiHDZ44U
Enjoy and please pass it on to the troops, their families, friends and forums or blogs you may visit.
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